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 Post subject: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 7:32 am 
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Mod note: moved from "Help with case!"

I really dislike it when ENTIRE 1AC's are posted for everyone to see. I think it kind of ruins debate. That's just my opinion.

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 Post subject: Re: Help with case!
PostPosted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:16 am 
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chaching wrote:
I really dislike it when ENTIRE 1AC's are posted for everyone to see. I think it kind of ruins debate. That's just my opinion.
But you want someone to save a project that encouraged people to post flows of cases other than their own?

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 2:44 pm 
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chaching wrote:
Mod note: moved from "Help with case!"

I really dislike it when ENTIRE 1AC's are posted for everyone to see. I think it kind of ruins debate. That's just my opinion.


What are you planning on doing? Are you requesting that everyone stop putting their own case? Or...?

I'm curious why the complaint came without a means to rectify it (not to mention the lack of warrants for "ruined debate"). Would you care to elaborate upon your position?

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:38 pm 
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Then don't read the case?

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:39 pm 
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chaching wrote:
Mod note: moved from "Help with case!"

I really dislike it when ENTIRE 1AC's are posted for everyone to see. I think it kind of ruins debate. That's just my opinion.

My partner and I posted our entire 1AC online last year. It was online for everyone to see pretty much the entire year. I updated it, and responded to people's questions/arguments.

We went undefeated on aff (besides one bogus ballot at nats).

How does this ruin debate?

::EDIT:: It's still on scribd, lol. And the thread can be found in the HSD archives.

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:54 pm 
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This is a major facet of the openness debate. Basically, the issue boils down to this:

1. Posting your case and actively seeking feedback can help you personally, sometimes significantly. (Empirically demonstrated by the testimonies of various people, including myself, who have done this.)
2. Knowledge of the detailed contents of a 1AC can often (but not always) increase he depth and quality of debate in-round.
3. There is some potential for free-riding. Whether this is a significant problem depends on your point of view.
4. Detailed knowedge can decrease the surprise factor, which some find desirable; you can just politely ignore the 1AC if you want to have to think on your feet.

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 10:53 pm 
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chaching wrote:
Mod note: moved from "Help with case!"

I really dislike it when ENTIRE 1AC's are posted for everyone to see. I think it kind of ruins debate. That's just my opinion.


For me, posting my entire case is the best thing for me to do. For other people, it may be best just to keep it within your club. I know that.
a) I don't have a coach.
b) I don't have much of a club. I have one other TP team to bounce ideas off of.

Basically, I want to do well this year. To do that, I have to be proactive in getting feedback. Hence the posting of my 1AC. If people want to help me, then they may. If not, well, you can abstain from clicking the URL. Easy as eating Christmas pie. Yum.

That is my justification.

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:27 am 
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Openness again? Wow.

In reference to the OP--is this posting your own 1AC or someone else's 1AC? Two completely different things.

Oh, and btw, in college (where the quality of debate is much higher), every school that I've seen except one will let you copy down their evidence after the round. I always ask for sites on interesting evidence and everyone always gives them. Some debaters literally come with digital cameras to take pictures of evidence, and everyone's fine with it. It just means we should probably cut answers to our own cards. What a concept :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:56 am 
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LocutusofBorg wrote:
In reference to the OP--is this posting your own 1AC or someone else's 1AC? Two completely different things.
I moved his post from "Help with case!", in which someone else uploaded his own 1AC to Google Docs and asked for critiques, so the post is somewhat out of context in this thread. I just moved it here in case a discussion would begin.

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2010 7:42 am 
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LocutusofBorg wrote:
Some debaters literally come with digital cameras to take pictures of evidence.
My former partner did that last year... and got grilled. We really don't have an acceptance of that in our league, but I do agree that it would be helpful, in order to be able to do more thorough researching.

@OP: I don't see how theres a problem here.
a. Theres nothing wrong with it imo (I think its helpful for people to tell me the args against my case, so I'll be ready to respond later on. It's a good thing to be open with your 1AC)
b. No harm... (Like others have said... if you don't like it, then don't read it. It's not hurting you)

So there is no problem with it... and you can get a benefit out of it :). Net benefits ftw :D

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 7:06 am 
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lucky13 wrote:
LocutusofBorg wrote:
Some debaters literally come with digital cameras to take pictures of evidence.
My former partner did that last year... and got grilled. We really don't have an acceptance of that in our league, but I do agree that it would be helpful, in order to be able to do more thorough researching.

Well I really don't suggest doing that in the NCFCA/Stoa. I could only imagine what would happen to a team that tried to do that. What I'm saying is that other teams having your evidence isn't necessarily bad for debate, and given the fact that prolly to two most open teams that I've seen are Western Kentucky and Hillsdale, which happen to be two of the top LD schools in the country...yeah...doesn't kill quality of debate.

EDIT:
Or prevent you from winning.

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2010 3:26 am 
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chaching wrote:
Mod note: moved from "Help with case!"

I really dislike it when ENTIRE 1AC's are posted for everyone to see. I think it kind of ruins debate. That's just my opinion.

The purpose of publicizing 1ACs in public places is to get helpful critiques from several people. It makes your case stronger, it familarizes you with the negative arguments, and sometimes, it tells you that your case is absolutely terrible and you need a new one ASAP. ;)
(had this happen to me once)

If you really don't want your case in cyberspace, then don't publish it, but it's always gonna be your loss, because if you're trying to hide your case from good debaters in fears that they will kill it with a massive brief, but really, if you face a really good team, chances are they'll beat you anyways. By publishing your case online and gaining feedback from those debaters, you will already know prior to the tournament what arguments they're thinking about and you can think of your own responses or move on to a new case.

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Last edited by lookingforangels on Tue Dec 28, 2010 5:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2010 4:29 pm 
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chaching wrote:
Mod note: moved from "Help with case!"

I really dislike it when ENTIRE 1AC's are posted for everyone to see. I think it kind of ruins debate. That's just my opinion.

Then don't do it.


If you think that someone else posting their case will help in your neg preparation, congrats. Study the case and work out your strategy. If you think as aff posting your case is going to make you weaker, then I guess you shouldn't post it.

Really, I don't see what's so hard about this.
That remark is not directed at you specifically, but at anyone who wants to have this conversation. If you hate it, don't do it. Problem solved.

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 Post subject: Re: Publicizing 1ACs
PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2010 8:41 pm 
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FYI, people brief up even more on the squirrelly cases that the author won't talk about. My case was a squirrel, but I was open about it. That didn't hurt, but rather it helped me. But whenever me and my homies found out about a "secret" case, we briefed up on it. Big time. And that case got smashed.

At least, this is how we operated in R8 last year ;)

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